| Username | Post: Accel efi setup, which one?? (Topic#190456) |
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goatlips
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| 05-26-08 09:17 AM - Post#1441316
https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?fi...
Hi guys posted this in the performance section above.
I would like to fit Accel efi kit,to my 350/420hp chevy. I'm looking at the new Thurster kit or the Pro- ram complete kit. Can you guys tell me what the differences are between the to kits??
Cheers,
David
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| Danny Cabral
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| 05-26-08 12:59 PM - Post#1441453
In response to goatlips
The Accel/DFI Thruster is only the engine management system but with more features than the GEN 7 ECU: http://www.accel-ignition.com/PressReleaseDetails....
The Accel/DFI Pro-Ram is for high RPM use (single plane intake manifold): http://www.accel-dfi.com/ProductDetails.aspx?brand...
Are you sure you shouldn't be looking at their Street Ram?
May God's Grace Bless You
'78 BRONCO: 508' stroker, TFS heads, Dominator MPFI & DIS, A/C, Lentech Strip Terminator AOD, 3:1 Atlas II, modified Dana 44/60-lockers-4.10s, hydroboost/4-disc brakes, ram-assist/heim joint steering, 4' lift, 35' tires |
| goatlips
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| 05-26-08 01:17 PM - Post#1441463
In response to Danny Cabral
Hi,I think the pro ram is what I'm looking for as I have a 350 chevy in a light weight AC Cobra. Is it worth spending the extra money for the Thruster ECU etc??
| Danny Cabral
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| 05-26-08 02:45 PM - Post#1441506
In response to goatlips
Hi, I think the Pro Ram is what I'm looking for, as I have a 350 Chevy in a lightweight AC Cobra. Is it worth spending the extra money for the Thruster ECU etc??
You are correct, a lightweight AC Cobra doesn't require much low RPM torque. (You didn't provide application details until now.) Since the Thruster EFI is an engine management system only, you provide whichever intake manifold & throttle body that best suits your vehicle needs.
As far as I know, the Thruster EFI ECU was primarily developed with enhanced features for 'forced induction' applications (turbocharged, supercharged & nitrous oxide): http://www.mrgasket.com/primages/74342G.pdf
If your engine is 'naturally aspirated', then you may not need this ECU since the GEN 7 ECU is already capable of sequential EFI with add-on features: http://go.mrgasket.com/pdf/DFI_05.pdf
I'd also like to hear more on this from others.
May God's Grace Bless You
'78 BRONCO: 508' stroker, TFS heads, Dominator MPFI & DIS, A/C, Lentech Strip Terminator AOD, 3:1 Atlas II, modified Dana 44/60-lockers-4.10s, hydroboost/4-disc brakes, ram-assist/heim joint steering, 4' lift, 35' tires |
| goatlips
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| 05-26-08 03:22 PM - Post#1441523
In response to Danny Cabral
Hi, I think the Pro Ram is what I'm looking for, as I have a 350 Chevy in a lightweight AC Cobra. Is it worth spending the extra money for the Thruster ECU etc??
You are correct, a lightweight AC Cobra doesn't require much low RPM torque. (You didn't provide application details until now.) Since the Thruster EFI is an engine management system only, you provide whichever intake manifold & throttle body that best suits your vehicle needs. As far as I know, the Thruster EFI ECU was primarily developed with enhanced features for 'forced induction' applications (turbocharged, supercharged & nitrous oxide): http://www.mrgasket.com/primages/74342G.pdf If your engine is 'naturally aspirated', then you may not need this ECU since the GEN 7 ECU is already capable of sequential EFI with add-on features: http://go.mrgasket.com/pdf/DFI_05.pdf I'd also like to hear more on this from others.
Thanks for your help, does the pro-ram complete injection kit p/n 77142 come with a GEN 7 control unit that fires sequential??
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autof...
Edited by goatlips on 05-26-08 03:26 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
| Old Buzzard
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| 05-26-08 03:52 PM - Post#1441544
In response to goatlips
I've used the Gen7 Pro, and find it's not near as 'friendly' as the FAST XFI system.
I use the GEN 7 on my HEMI, and the FAST on the turbo Buick.
What I DON'T like about the 7:
**EXPENSIVE WB add-on.
Requires a mounting/harness for a seperate WB box.
** The pro model required a USB plugin key, to get to the 'pro' version'. More money, and was suseptable to damage, if you had to move the laptop.
I did like the PnP ignition. I used the Dual Sync dist to get the sequential signal.
In the USA, the FAST seems to be the more popular.
Another is the Big Stuff 3.. I've not used it, but those that have like it's many features.
All 3 units have data logging capabilities.
just my $.02...
Chuck
Hotrodding and dragracing since 1955..
Injector inspector, and certifiable EFI nut.
Back to 55, again, for the 6th time.
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| Danny Cabral
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| 05-26-08 03:55 PM - Post#1441547
In response to goatlips
Thanks for your help, does the Pro-Ram complete injection kit p/n 77142 come with a GEN 7 control unit that fires sequential??
This is where things get confusing with the Accel DFI kits. The Calmap software and firmware revisions 4.0 & higher are Gen 7+, capable of sequential EFI.
The firmware versions 3.2 & lower are Gen 7. I don't think these older versions are capable of sequential EFI until you upgrade the firmware, so the answer is 'not yet'.
At this point, you know as much as I do and you should give Accel a call (unless someone else has more info).
http://www.haysclutches.com/ftp/calmap/ACCEL%20DF I...
May God's Grace Bless You
'78 BRONCO: 508' stroker, TFS heads, Dominator MPFI & DIS, A/C, Lentech Strip Terminator AOD, 3:1 Atlas II, modified Dana 44/60-lockers-4.10s, hydroboost/4-disc brakes, ram-assist/heim joint steering, 4' lift, 35' tires |
| goatlips
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| 05-26-08 04:29 PM - Post#1441564
In response to Danny Cabral
Thanks guys, There is very little info anywhere about the Accel efi, and no info about the different systems they do and don't do! I think I will give the tech guys a call.
As grumpy say's in the other forum stick with the carb!
| BrianEsser
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| 05-26-08 04:56 PM - Post#1441588
In response to goatlips
I'd skip Accel and go with the FAST XFI or the Big Stuff 3 if you can afford it. They are the best EFI management systems available.
| goatlips
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| 05-26-08 05:16 PM - Post#1441601
In response to BrianEsser
I'd skip Accel and go with the FAST XFI or the Big Stuff 3 if you can afford it. They are the best EFI management systems available.
Do you have any further infomation on that?? Never heard of them this side of the pond! Where is the best place to buy?? Does it come complete etc??
Edited by goatlips on 05-26-08 05:17 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
| BrianEsser
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| 05-26-08 05:35 PM - Post#1441616
In response to goatlips
Heres the site for FAST http://www.fuelairspark.com/
As for Big Stuff 3. It's so solid. It's what many OEM's use to prototype their ECM's. It can pretty much do anything and work with just about any combo out there.
Here is BS3's homepage.
http://www.bigstuff3.com/index2.html
| Bullshark
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| 05-26-08 07:24 PM - Post#1441756
In response to Danny Cabral
The Accel/DFI Thruster is only the engine management system but with more features than the GEN 7 ECU: http://www.accel-ignition.com/PressReleaseDetails....
The Accel/DFI Pro-Ram is for high RPM use (single plane intake manifold): http://www.accel-dfi.com/ProductDetails.aspx?brand...
Are you sure you shouldn't be looking at their Street Ram?
Danny, Actually the Thruster is a lower cost version of the Gen VII DFI ECU. It is programed to have a subset of it's capability. It is probably adequate for most general applications. It was released to provide a more affordable option vs the Accel Gen VII and the Fast XFI. I opted for the Accel Gen VII on my RamJet 502 replacing the MEFI 3. It is like having a whole new engine. The Gen VII comes with the Sportsman Key which provides all the flexibility needed for a most applications. I purchased the Pro-Key and have even more capability. More than can be easily explained here.
David,
The main differences between the Fast XFI and the Gen VII as stated above is that the Fast system has an integrated UEGO function. It also has a slightly larger fuel map table. 16x17 cells vs 16x16. For my intended applications these were the only significant performance differences.
At least at the time I purchased, the Accel Gen VII was a significantly lower cost alternative, even when adding the additional $179 LC-1 wide band O2 module. I discounted the extra fuel map cells since they both do a weighted interpolation between cells and the maps could be scalable.
I have looked closely at all the afermarket ECU tuning software and I don't buy the statements that the Accel Calmap is not as capable or harder to use. If you truly understand the physics of controlling an engine, the Accel Calmap S/W with the Pro-key is hard to beat. It also has capability for generating base maps for semi-auto tune which will get you close. I understand that Accel is close to releasing a Gen VIII with more capability like coil on plug. etc. etc.
I updated my RamJet for a little over $1300 including the LC-1 and a GM 502 Knock sensor module. I built my own harness and interface board wanting to get a cleaner more professional setup. I hate those plastic accordion harness shields.
Bullshark
Edited by Bullshark on 05-26-08 07:46 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
| Danny Cabral
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| 05-27-08 02:24 AM - Post#1441962
In response to Bullshark
Thanks for clarifying some details, Bullshark. Accel sure makes the new Thruster sound like their 'latest & greatest' ECU: http://www.accel-ignition.com/PressReleaseDetails....
May God's Grace Bless You
'78 BRONCO: 508' stroker, TFS heads, Dominator MPFI & DIS, A/C, Lentech Strip Terminator AOD, 3:1 Atlas II, modified Dana 44/60-lockers-4.10s, hydroboost/4-disc brakes, ram-assist/heim joint steering, 4' lift, 35' tires |
| weez58
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| 05-28-08 02:33 PM - Post#1443184
In response to Danny Cabral
I just got my Gen7 system dialed in. My complaint with the Accel system was the lack of support. I called the tech line a few times and got voicemail. My calls were never returned. I was able to solve my problems with the help of people like Bullshark and Doug at Herzog Racing. I fought an issue with timing during cranking. It turned out to be that my MSD distributor wasn't compatible with the Accel system. I replaced it with an Accel dual sync and I'm now a happy camper. Now that I've learned the system, I love it and would recommend it. I just wish there was support like this forum has for the 950!
My $.02
| '70 Vette roadster, 383, Dart Pro 1 heads, Ultradyne cam 250d @ .050', Accel Gen 7 EFI, single plane w/port injection, 1200cfm 4 barrel throttle body. |
| CarPro7763
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| 05-29-08 08:21 AM - Post#1443810
In response to goatlips
Hi David
The ACCEL DFI THRUSTER EFI Engine Management System is an entry level system that is based on the GEN7; that is why it can be upgraded to Pro Version in the future if you so choose. The THRUSTER offers 35 Screens of tune-ability and diagnostics while the Pro version offers 144 screens.
The Pro Ram Plug & Play EFI system is a complete EFI system that comes with the THRUSTER EFI electronics. You will still need a distributor, ignition box,coil to get it running.
ACCEL DFI has recently released an Engine Builder Kitwhich comes with everything you will need to convert to EFI including all of the ignition components and the wideband O2 / Datalogger.
Take a look at capabilities below of the THRUSTER EFI SYSTEM. Very imp-ressive for under $1000.00 with a narrow band and under $1400.00.
Any questions? thrusterefi@mrgasket.com
• THRUSTER EFI: Is an entry level EFI system for the masses.
• System Capability: Whether you have a 200HP or a 1200 HP engine, Naturally Aspirated, Nitrous, Turbo or Supercharged, the system is capable of running it.
• Real Time Programming: Using a Laptop, you can fully program the ECU in real time. All changes happen instantly.
• O2 Sensors: The system uses a Narrow Band or Wide Band O2 Sensor.
• Closed Loop Operations: Utilizing the Wide Band O2 in closed loop, You command what Air/Fuel Ratio you want and the wide band will auto correct up to + or - 25% (A great tool for tuning especially when using Nitrous, Turbo or Supercharged applications).
• Volumetric Efficiency: The System is Volumetric Efficiency based just like an OEM. This type of system makes an 800HP small block start and run like a stocker.
• Target Injector Timing: The system allows you to target when the injectors fire in relation to crank rotation. This can enhance drive-ability and can increase horsepower by as mush as 10%. No other system offers this.
• Power Enrichment: Power Enrichment Mode offers a way for you to switch on the fly, to an alternate Target Air-to-Fuel Ratio table. This provides a means of calibrating the ECM for both fuel economy and performance at the same time.
• E85 Capability: The System can be configured to switch on the fly from gasoline to E85 fuel.
• Injector capability: The system is capable of running High or Low Impedance injectors in Sequential or Batch Fire.
• Individual Cylinder Control: The System is capable controlling the fueling of each cylinder individually at all RPM and Load parameters. (If #3 cylinder is lean at 59% load between 3000 and 5000 RPM, add fuel to that cylinder only at those parameters.) No other systems offers it this way.
• Injector Sequential Operation: To run in Sequential, you will need an ACCEL DFI Dual Sync Distributor that has the crank & cam signals built in.
• Using OEM Distributors: A stock OEM EFI distributor like GM L98 (TPI) or Ford TFI can also be used but the injectors will have to be run in batch fire.
• Using a carbureted style distributor: If you are using a distributor from a carbureted engine that has centrifugal advance, you must lock down the advance and install an adjustable phase-able rotor (if possible) to prevent engine kickback while starting.
(Failure to do so will cause numerous issues that include: Broken starters, no start conditions, spark scatter and erratic timing).
• Ignition Capability: The system can run 11 different ignition systems.
GM HEI
FORD TFI
IPU - Honda VTEC
PU with Cam Sync
Hall Effect
Hall Effect with Cam Sync (DFI Dual Sync)
Optispark
Buick GN V6
GM LS1 - LS6
Ignition Coil -Neg. (Fuel ONLY)
Custom
• Auto Programming Nitrous: The System comes with 1 stage Nitrous control. Input your Nitrous Jet Size in inches (.038), how many jets and the ECM calculates the required additional fuel. Use the timing trim table, enter the amount of degrees you want the ECM to pull when the system activates.
• Knock Control: The System is capable of knock control (Not recommended when using Roller Rockers, Solid Roller or Solid Flat tappet camshafts)
• Torque Converter Lockup: The System can control torque converter lock up functions on GM TH200R4 and TH700R4 Transmissions.
• A/C Control: The System can control A/C on most applications.
• Radiator Fan Control: If you are running electrical fans for the radiator, the System can control 2 of them.
• 2 Step Rev Limiter: The system can control a 2 step rev limiter while you are on the trans brake.
• Over Rev Limiter: The System offer 2 separate Over Rev limiters, one controls ignition the other controls fuel.
• Data Acquisition: You can record up to 6 channels through the ECM and laptop or up to 14 total channels when using the DATAMAP part of the Wide Band O2.
• Shift Light: You can program a shift light RPM in the ECM to activate a shift light.
• Self Diagnostics: The system offers OEM style self diagnostics, if a code is triggered, you can view the code and the explanation of the problem on your laptop. It can also trigger a service engine soon light to let you know of a problem.
• Limp Mode: The system will never leave you stranded, if one of the sensors it utilizes goes bad. It switches the sensors parameters to default mode, so you can make it home.
• THRUSTER PRO: The system if fully upgradeable to a Pro Version that opens up the door to numerous bells and whistle. (3 Stages of Nitrous, Boost Builder for Turbo applications, 4 separate Target A/F tables, run up to 4 injectors per cylinder). All this and more without replacing any harnesses or cutting any wires.
• Safeties: The system has built in safeties to keep your engine from needing expensive repairs. (It calculates the VE while tuning and if the injector duty cycle exceeds 95% it sets a code to let you know that you need larger injectors. While using Nitrous, it will disable the Nitrous if the injector duty cycle exceeds 95%, You can also use the engine saver mode when utilizing the wide band O2 to disable the Nitrous if the Air/Fuel ratio falls below set parameters).
| BrianEsser
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| 05-29-08 12:27 PM - Post#1443982
In response to CarPro7763
I take it you work for Accel?
| CarPro7763
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| 05-29-08 12:57 PM - Post#1444004
In response to BrianEsser
Only been at DFI for almost 2 years. Use to be a dealer for them and FAST since their inception.
| Hotrodrobert
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| 05-30-08 09:52 AM - Post#1444628
In response to CarPro7763
I have used Big Stuff, Accel, and FAST and have been happy with the results an all. One thing about the Big Stuff-if you have any issues and need to talk to the real boss, he is Joe MEANY and he earned the name!! Not just one opinion.
Accel, FAST, and Big Stuff were developed originally by Joe Meaney. Accel and FAST are now well staffed and well developed.
Accel and FAST have been very helpful to even an idiot like me.
| Danny Cabral
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| 05-30-08 09:57 AM - Post#1444633
In response to Hotrodrobert
The name is John Meaney.
- efiguy - EFI University Said:
Actually, If we are going to go around handing out credit where credit is due, it should be mentioned that guys were around in the very early eighties building much higher quality systems than anything Mr. Meany ever touched.
Guys like Graham Western, founder of EFI Technology, who developed (nearly from scratch) the engine management systems used throughout the eighties and nineties by Cosworth in their engine programs....
Men like Ole Buehl who builds the very high quality Euro EFI Technology system.
Guys like Todd Knighton who single-handedly reverse engineered the factory Porsche Motronics ECUs, made a method for converting them from L-JetTronic to Speed Density, then built his own real time emulator and interface software that anyone could buy and use to tune their Porsches.
People in Australia like Bill Mitchell who (presumably) built the very first laptop programmable ECUs called Haltech.
And lets not forget the Richard Aubert and Richard Bendell team of Aubert Electronics Company, who in the early eighties, developed a product labeled 'Motec'. That team later split up and one member founder Autronics, while the other kept the Motec name alive. These are two of the finest engine controllers I have seen to date!
What John Meany did was basically sell out his ideas to a company with enough marketing and manufacturing funds to make ECUs cheap enough so that nearly everyone could buy one for their hot rods.
While we here in the USA have to give a lot of credit for such a shrewd move, which really brought the prospect of having an EFI based hotrod alive, it was hardly his 'technology' that drove the industry.
Most of the systems I have seen come from John have been average at best and definitely centered around the 'middle of the road' marketplace.
Furthermore, word on the street is that just about every company who has ever been involved with him has ended the relationship on less than pleasant terms, and a few even claim to have documentation of such things.
The fact that he was involved in the early FAST system has little to do with what they offer today. Their new XFI system is a dramatic departure from the old stuff and is a much more flexible platform.
The one thing I will say is that of the things he did, most of them were fairly reliable, though inflexible to the end user.
I have used the 'Big Stuff3' system only once, so admittedly I am not in a position to make a thorough assessment of its true capability or reliability, however I was largely unimpressed at the Graphic User Interface and its lack of documentation. The system claims to be able to do a lot of 'stuff' but so far I find it lacking. Again, it is based at mostly the GM drag racer 'middle of the road' marketplace, so I don't think it will ever be a real threat anywhere else to any of the established 'racing quality' ECUs.
May God's Grace Bless You
'78 BRONCO: 508' stroker, TFS heads, Dominator MPFI & DIS, A/C, Lentech Strip Terminator AOD, 3:1 Atlas II, modified Dana 44/60-lockers-4.10s, hydroboost/4-disc brakes, ram-assist/heim joint steering, 4' lift, 35' tires |
| goatlips
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| 06-11-08 03:06 PM - Post#1453710
In response to CarPro7763
Hi David
The ACCEL DFI THRUSTER EFI Engine Management System is an entry level system that is based on the GEN7; that is why it can be upgraded to Pro Version in the future if you so choose. The THRUSTER offers 35 Screens of tune-ability and diagnostics while the Pro version offers 144 screens.
The Pro Ram Plug & Play EFI system is a complete EFI system that comes with the THRUSTER EFI electronics. You will still need a distributor, ignition box,coil to get it running.
ACCEL DFI has recently released an Engine Builder Kitwhich comes with everything you will need to convert to EFI including all of the ignition components and the wideband O2 / Datalogger.
Take a look at capabilities below of the THRUSTER EFI SYSTEM. Very imp-ressive for under $1000.00 with a narrow band and under $1400.00.
Any questions? thrusterefi@mrgasket.com
• THRUSTER EFI: Is an entry level EFI system for the masses.
• System Capability: Whether you have a 200HP or a 1200 HP engine, Naturally Aspirated, Nitrous, Turbo or Supercharged, the system is capable of running it.
• Real Time Programming: Using a Laptop, you can fully program the ECU in real time. All changes happen instantly.
• O2 Sensors: The system uses a Narrow Band or Wide Band O2 Sensor.
• Closed Loop Operations: Utilizing the Wide Band O2 in closed loop, You command what Air/Fuel Ratio you want and the wide band will auto correct up to + or - 25% (A great tool for tuning especially when using Nitrous, Turbo or Supercharged applications).
• Volumetric Efficiency: The System is Volumetric Efficiency based just like an OEM. This type of system makes an 800HP small block start and run like a stocker.
• Target Injector Timing: The system allows you to target when the injectors fire in relation to crank rotation. This can enhance drive-ability and can increase horsepower by as mush as 10%. No other system offers this.
• Power Enrichment: Power Enrichment Mode offers a way for you to switch on the fly, to an alternate Target Air-to-Fuel Ratio table. This provides a means of calibrating the ECM for both fuel economy and performance at the same time.
• E85 Capability: The System can be configured to switch on the fly from gasoline to E85 fuel.
• Injector capability: The system is capable of running High or Low Impedance injectors in Sequential or Batch Fire.
• Individual Cylinder Control: The System is capable controlling the fueling of each cylinder individually at all RPM and Load parameters. (If #3 cylinder is lean at 59% load between 3000 and 5000 RPM, add fuel to that cylinder only at those parameters.) No other systems offers it this way.
• Injector Sequential Operation: To run in Sequential, you will need an ACCEL DFI Dual Sync Distributor that has the crank & cam signals built in.
• Using OEM Distributors: A stock OEM EFI distributor like GM L98 (TPI) or Ford TFI can also be used but the injectors will have to be run in batch fire.
• Using a carbureted style distributor: If you are using a distributor from a carbureted engine that has centrifugal advance, you must lock down the advance and install an adjustable phase-able rotor (if possible) to prevent engine kickback while starting.
(Failure to do so will cause numerous issues that include: Broken starters, no start conditions, spark scatter and erratic timing).
• Ignition Capability: The system can run 11 different ignition systems.
GM HEI
FORD TFI
IPU - Honda VTEC
PU with Cam Sync
Hall Effect
Hall Effect with Cam Sync (DFI Dual Sync)
Optispark
Buick GN V6
GM LS1 - LS6
Ignition Coil -Neg. (Fuel ONLY)
Custom
• Auto Programming Nitrous: The System comes with 1 stage Nitrous control. Input your Nitrous Jet Size in inches (.038), how many jets and the ECM calculates the required additional fuel. Use the timing trim table, enter the amount of degrees you want the ECM to pull when the system activates.
• Knock Control: The System is capable of knock control (Not recommended when using Roller Rockers, Solid Roller or Solid Flat tappet camshafts)
• Torque Converter Lockup: The System can control torque converter lock up functions on GM TH200R4 and TH700R4 Transmissions.
• A/C Control: The System can control A/C on most applications.
• Radiator Fan Control: If you are running electrical fans for the radiator, the System can control 2 of them.
• 2 Step Rev Limiter: The system can control a 2 step rev limiter while you are on the trans brake.
• Over Rev Limiter: The System offer 2 separate Over Rev limiters, one controls ignition the other controls fuel.
• Data Acquisition: You can record up to 6 channels through the ECM and laptop or up to 14 total channels when using the DATAMAP part of the Wide Band O2.
• Shift Light: You can program a shift light RPM in the ECM to activate a shift light.
• Self Diagnostics: The system offers OEM style self diagnostics, if a code is triggered, you can view the code and the explanation of the problem on your laptop. It can also trigger a service engine soon light to let you know of a problem.
• Limp Mode: The system will never leave you stranded, if one of the sensors it utilizes goes bad. It switches the sensors parameters to default mode, so you can make it home.
• THRUSTER PRO: The system if fully upgradeable to a Pro Version that opens up the door to numerous bells and whistle. (3 Stages of Nitrous, Boost Builder for Turbo applications, 4 separate Target A/F tables, run up to 4 injectors per cylinder). All this and more without replacing any harnesses or cutting any wires.
• Safeties: The system has built in safeties to keep your engine from needing expensive repairs. (It calculates the VE while tuning and if the injector duty cycle exceeds 95% it sets a code to let you know that you need larger injectors. While using Nitrous, it will disable the Nitrous if the injector duty cycle exceeds 95%, You can also use the engine saver mode when utilizing the wide band O2 to disable the Nitrous if the Air/Fuel ratio falls below set parameters).
Thanks for your post! Can you not buy the ACCEL DFI THRUSTER EFI as a complete kit?? Is it worth spending the extra money over the plug and play kit?? Where is the best place to buy?? How much to upgrade it to pro??
Cheers,
David
Edited by goatlips on 06-11-08 03:10 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
| CarPro7763
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| 06-12-08 08:50 AM - Post#1454213
In response to goatlips
Yes, you can purchase the system as a Plug & Play kit or as a Engine Builder Kit.
The Plug & Play kit comes complete with manifold/rails, injectors, fuel pressure regulator, throttle body, sensors, ECM, main harness, injector harness, IPU or L98 HEI ignition harness, fuel pump, com cable and software. Engine builder kit includes all the above plus the Dual Sync Distributor, DFI 6 A Digital Ignition CD Module, DFI E-Core Coil and DFI Wide Band O2/Data Logger.
ACCEL DFI has a network of EMICs (Engine Management Installation Centers). You can locate them on our website http://www.accel-dfi.com/DealerLookup.aspx?brandId...
or you can email us direct at thrusterefi@mrgasket.com for a dealer that we might recommend that is familiar with the application that your working with.
Good luck
| Dangerous Danny
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| 06-23-08 08:42 PM - Post#1462661
In response to CarPro7763
I have two Edelbrock Pro Flo RPM EFI units and love them. The first one I bought just over 2 years ago. Edelbrock gave me all the help I needed to tune it, plus I didn't need a laptop to set it up. The first one I had on a 454 BBC that was around 475HP @ 500TQ. The second one I just got 3 months ago, and it went on a 519cu.' BBC stroker 560HP @ 5000RPM, 650TQ @ 3700RPM,dyno run, and it works just as good. The new Edelbrock I bought can be hooked up to your laptop for tuning or you can use the hand set by itself.
I hope you can find one that works for your engine.
| AZDoug
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| 06-26-08 02:22 PM - Post#1464831
In response to Bullshark
What is the LC-1 wideband module?
I can't find it in the Accel catalogue,a nd $179 sounds better than $650 for the wideband/dataloger box.
Thanks,
Doug
| Danny Cabral
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| 06-26-08 02:41 PM - Post#1464841
In response to AZDoug
What is the LC-1 wideband module?
I can't find it in the Accel catalogue,and $179 sounds better than $650 for the wideband/datalogger box. Thanks, Doug
It's a wideband O2 sensor kit: http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/lc1.ph...
This is how it's used with a C950 kit: https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?ti...
May God's Grace Bless You
'78 BRONCO: 508' stroker, TFS heads, Dominator MPFI & DIS, A/C, Lentech Strip Terminator AOD, 3:1 Atlas II, modified Dana 44/60-lockers-4.10s, hydroboost/4-disc brakes, ram-assist/heim joint steering, 4' lift, 35' tires |
| Bullshark
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| 06-26-08 03:22 PM - Post#1464870
In response to AZDoug
Check on flea-bay, that's where I got mine for $179
Bullshark
| AZDoug
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| 06-27-08 09:27 AM - Post#1465410
In response to Bullshark
What i want to know is why you need a dual sync distrib for SEFI other than to sell you more hardware?
The std HEI distrib seems to be able to tell the ECU where the engine is with enough accuracy to fire two batches 180 distributor degrees apart, at, I assume, a particular place of camshaft/distributor rotation, why not eight pulses 45 degrees apart?
Or is batch fire simply fired without regard to cam/distibutor rotor position, but simply every 180 degrees, and if this is the case, why not still have eight individual pulses if distrib timing doesn't matter for batch?
Doug
| CarPro7763
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| 06-27-08 09:58 AM - Post#1465430
In response to AZDoug
HEI Distributors do not offer a cam signal which is required for sequential injector firing. Batch fire is ok, except for the fact that your engine will idle better, accelerate better and will get better gas mileage with sequential injector firing. So a Dual Sync is definitely the way to go when installing an EFI system.
| AZDoug
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| 06-27-08 11:55 AM - Post#1465524
In response to CarPro7763
But what, if any, signal does batch fire use to time when the batch fire?? Or is it just a random spot picked out and then repeated every 180 distrib degrees?
Doug
| CarPro7763
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| 06-27-08 12:27 PM - Post#1465557
In response to AZDoug
Batch mode will fire 4 injectors every 180 Deg randomly.
| AZDoug
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| 06-27-08 04:42 PM - Post#1465722
In response to CarPro7763
So there is no correlation to crank or cam position when a batch fires?
I was under the impression that batch A fired say at Number 1 intake stroke, and 8,4 and 3 fired at the same time, the batch B fired at #6 intake and 5, 7 and 2 fired at that time also, so at least some semblance of efficency was achieved, if the batches just fire at any old place, it isn't much better than a piddle valve type injector system that runs all the time. Heck, why not simply sequentially fire anyway in the normal firing order, if it is randomly started, at least you would avoid the large pressure drops per batch.
I would have thought that someone, some where (like at GM, maybe) would have said 'hey, lets use the number one ditributor reluctor to not only synce the distrib, but via a simple program change, use the then established number one cylinder to time the injector pulses and do sequential off that', rather than go the cam signal route and require a special distributor.
It seems simple to me, when setting up the normal HEI distrib, you put engine at TDC, align the distrib, set the timing at 10 degrees advance the usual way, then bring engine back to TDC, and tell the computer that the engine is at TDC, start doing sequential injection at cylinder #6, or whatever the best cylinder location would be.
Or maybe that would only work as long as the engine is running and everything would be lost once the computer is off,and the engine continues to turn as it slows toa stop, as there is no true home position on a regular HEI distrib. And if the computer can't tell where number 1 cylinder is from the distrib, maybe someone (like at GM), should have added that simple feature 20 years ago.
Doug
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